This thread is to discuss how our serialization system works and how you will be impacted and how you can use it to increase your revenue*.


The Goal of Serialization:

- To provide a method of tracking actual use of the software
- To provide an object to which support and access to ongoing software updates can be tracked
- To provide a transferable license from reseller to merchant or bewteen merchant to merchant
- Make CRE tons of cash


How does it impact your use of CRE Loaded products:

- You will not be able to activate and initially access a CRE Loaded admin interface without a valid serial
- Standard will require a serial - however we give them away for free to anyone that creates a customer account
- Pro and B2B products require a serial and you receive one with every purchase.
- Once you activate your and paid for your software, you will never be locked out in the future, not even when the serial expires
- Serials have expiration dates that corrolate with your support and patch access
- if our serial validation server is unreachble:
- and you have already activated the product, and are just returning to the admin, you will be able to enter after a 5 second timeout
- if you are trying to activate the product, you will not be able to do so until the server comes back
- the admin checks in to the validation server only once per day
- You can install a CRE Loaded product multiple times under the same domain with the same serial
- You can change the domain a serial is validated against by contacting CRE support.

What is validated or checked by the server:

- The serial itself - if it exist in our system
- Is the serial is valid - has it be revoked (due to fraud or refund)
- The Product - which product is this serial for
- The Domain - What domain is it valid for

I invite your questions about our serilization system.


*you gotta love how I added the revenue bit there, but it is true, resellers now have a solid reason to charge their customers for thier copy of CRE Pro and B2B, since it now requires a Serial to activate and be legit.

>>*you gotta love how I added the revenue bit there, but it is true, resellers now have a solid reason to charge their customers for thier copy of CRE Pro and B2B, since it now requires a Serial to activate and be legit.

If this is not against the GPL open source license it is against it's spirit.

Forget trying to control who uses the software and how it is used and on how many sites, and concentrate on giving the developers REASONS to sell new subscriptions.

Do not try to police something that is not enforceable.
All you will do is to drive support away from your system into the arms of the small developers.

Having the code poll your server is an invasion of privacy.

This is OPEN SOURCE software.. You CANNOT control it once released.

If you want some valid suggestions regarding the implementation and control of revenue , please pm me.


Reg
www.DotCom-Productions.com

Sal,

Is there an easy way for your legal team to release a statement regarding their interpretation of the gpl license and how it applies to a serial number activation which locks a software to a domain?

Such a statement may save much unneeded debate and heated postings?

Tahuti,

I have a grasp of Open Source GPL.

We cannot restrict its distrubtion once you have it, you can give it away to who ever you like. We can however make it do whatver we once when it runs. It is not against the GPL for a programmer to make a peice of software that displays text when run that says "I am not GPL". The
code that handles the serial logic, is unencoded, it itself is open source. You can edit it if you want. I mean, ya know, edit it.

THe code is open and unecoded, it is redistributable. It just happens to ask for a serial in the admin when it runs. We are putting this out there with the hope that store owners will find it worthwhile to purchase a valid serial.

We know that developers can bypass so it will run locally without a serial.

It may be a Pain in the Butt, and seen as pretentious, but it is not against GPL.

Thank you Sal. Perfect Answer. I think it a fair assessment of the intentions of the GPL License.

The one thought I have is this. My company many times deploys dev sites to a company server and then will push dev to live to whatever server the client wishes.

With this business model in place I will be FORCED to override your code??? as best I can tell.

Or what about clients that like to have dev.domain.com for their dev sites? will the serial work on subdomains too?

Just a few more thoughts to ponder.

Again bravo to Sal for trying to help us all understand this better.

We will work to extend the serial for dev site uses. In the mean time you can contact sales and we can give you extra serials to use as dev serials over and over.

Careful Sal or people will start calling you the answer man. You have done a wonderful job answering questions today. Thank you.

And I will post my still outstanding question (from late Aug/early Sept) here as well, hoping the third time is the charm.

What if you have one store with two domains? I have my main store and a secondary store at a different domain/different hosting for specific products and branded that way. They're both mine and they both go back to my company, and there's even overlap in products (think of it like Toys R Us and Babies R Us, you can get baby stuff at TRU and they're both the same company just slightly different names.)

How will the serial impact a situation like that? Can I contact support to get a second serial?

Gerald had said that he was looking into the answer and never got back to me, and I also posted on the other thread to which I see that you've answered other questions but not mine... hoping to get a good answer. I've been a solid CRE cheerleader in the past and I really appreciated it when CRE told me that even though I wasn't their direct customer, I was their customer, and made a very horrible situation right with me (I had to repurchase the cart, but it's all good now). I'll pay for two licenses if I have to, but I don't feel as if I should since it's the same company. Heck, I even EPA Export/Import the products back and forth.

Thanks!!!!!

Jupiter,

We would like you to purchase a second serial for your second store. The second serial would cost 25% less than the initial one. The idea is each domain/store brings you additional revenue and we would like to participate in that. Once again, this additional pricing is subject to change, and we are definetly going work with you and our customers on special pricing and additional serials on a case by case basis, especially those active on the forums, helping each other out and contributing to the project.

Also check out my post here concerning admin versus catalog impact of serialization

http://www.getcre.com/creshare/Forums/v ... 23791.html

Thank you, Sal. That sounds quite fair and doable, especially without the yearly subscription. I'm also a CRE Merchant account holder and love it. I'm technical enough to know usually what needs to be fixed, just not how. (In my other life "day job" I'm a help desk tech, but I'm far better at translating between the techs and our customers than I am at the coding aspect of things).

I was recently at an online event promoting our second url/romance publishing imprint and received many great comments from customers and potential customers about how easy to navigate the cart system was. Kudos!

Thanks again!
Mary/Jupiter Gardens, LLC

Sal, the GPL CLEARLY states
The freedom to run the program, for any purpose (freedom 0).


Once a client purchases the product it HAS to run.
NOT when they register, but right away.

Specifying that you can only run one registered copy is tantamount to restricting access to the runability of the code and your "rules" forbid it.

You really don't get it do you?
Either you are intentionally trying to squeeze by semi legalities or you are as dumb as a brick. and I don't think that is the case.

I for one do not want your nose in ANY of my businesses or having any reporting from my site.
Nothing personal, just the same reason I will not run GA.
MY business is MY business and the less you know the better.

I don't want to have to argue the legalities of the GPL, I FULLY understand them.

As 6.3 stands it does NOT look like a go for an across the board upgrade to my client's sites.
It is just two much to expect a full rebuild instead of a code change.
I also don't agree with the SEO "upgrade".

Release 3 versions.
6.3 security fixes only- no support. (NO registrations)
6.3 full - no support (NO registrations)
6.3 full support (Registrations)

Reg
www.DotCom-Productions.com
www.0Grief.com

Reg,

Thanks for your feedback. We will consider it.

As for GPL:
Remeber the code is completely unecoded it is open it runs, you can look at the code and do what you want. You can redistribute the code. YOu can take any part of the code and reuse it, you can alter it, you can do whatever your skills and time allow for with it.

As for the upgrading:
Would you feel a drop in upgrade would be more preferable?

Yes you can, that is freedom 1.
However the license in not satisfied until it is registered. It will NOT run until registered without code alterations, a violation of freedom 0.

I think a drop in update would be much better.
I just cannot see going to my clients and saying "CRELoaded V6.3 is out and has a security fix that is highly recommended."
"However to apply this I am going to have to rebuild your whole site."
"You will also face the possibility that your site's admin could be shut down because of the way the new registration is coded and dependent on CR's server".
"Chain Reaction swears that they will not do this but the possibility still exists."

What I do see happening is that the small developers will just strip out the reporting and perhaps even give the program away.
Agreed, this will stop the clients from obtaining CR support, but is your support really necessary for anyone that has hired a knowledgeable developer?

You are trying to police something you do not have any control over, and as a 12 year veteran of software sales, believe me when I say you will not succeed.

Reg
www.DotCom-Productions.com
www.0Grief.com

It occured to me that quite possibly your itentions were to maintain control of patches and support, right? Why not make the serialization a module drop in that IF you wish to maintain a subscription to future commercial grade patches and receive product support, you must activate the serialization support module to valid a paid subscription. The seperate module can be released under the GPL 3.0 Lesser.

Perhaps if removed from core cart functionality and placed as a seperate entity you could even release it as zend encoded. The functionality is only to verify you paid for commercial support. You could then sell it as a FDMS download with username and password to activate the new software. Ran as even possibly visual basic windows hooks using windows API. Run the program to submit support request or even a pin code to inititiate phone support like paypal does on their websites just to call them up and talk about your account.

Ad servers in the past have gone down due to data centers failure of hardware. Don't upset shopping carts from running because of hardware failure on a remote site not even related to their hosting account.

Definitely not a negative suggestion. I think it may help you win back die hards of open source.

Another suggestion is to abandone it, offer it up as a way for others to use in supporting their clients and move to your own software tools. Have people pay on your website to access your kayako software and phone in for support. Viola, solving a PR sticky point.

Just 3 quick questions:

After the licence expires, we have to buy another licence to keep using the software?

If we move host from cre to say another host in future, will the registration be affected in any way?

Does this tracking code is also included into the catalog part or just the admin?

I have to agree with RegDCP, I’m not very comfortable having some tracking code into my store, monitoring us, I think a better registration would be more adequate.